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today we're here with dylan adams a patent attorney with davis wright and tremaine which is a massive patent uh a firm and he's also written a book called patents demystified which is used by the american bar association stanford harvard mit and i'm sure the university of houston my alma mater uses it uh i'm surprised you didn't add them in there and he also has a youtube channel which is how i found him oddly enough called patents demystified as well i'll have links to all this stuff down in the description so thanks for joining us dylan we're glad to have you yeah you bet glad to be here so the reason i reached out to you is i'm involved in lure design lure making and i always see these kind of discussions explode on facebook online about oh you can't make this lure because it has a patent you can't do this because it has a patent and you know when i start digging into them um it most of the time they don't have patents they end up having trademarks but i think a good place to start would be my understanding is that the field of law is intellectual property is that right yeah exactly that's going to be what's going to be protecting these things is intellectual property in general and then the four types of intellectual property that you know that are possible are going to be patents trademarks copyrights and trade secrets but when it comes to lure is really you know trade secret isn't going to be applicable because you know you're going to be having stuff that's public maybe if you had like you know fake compositions you know that were secretive or maybe a secretive process but really i think what we would want to talk about here is going to be copyright sorry trademarks and and patents copyrights are related to artistic work as artistic as lures are you know the law sees them as being useful articles and so they're going to be covered by patents and then the branding stuff that stuff is going to be covered by trademark okay great the um and so my understanding is also two different types of patents at least maybe more yes exactly so the two that are applicable to lures and i think i sent you some examples of both of these so there are utility patents and then there are design patents so utility patents cover functionalities of things and they also do kind of cover design so in some ways it's kind of confusing um but they can cover sort of a physical article they can cover methods of manufacturing methods of using things whereas design patents they cover one very very specific design so they're a lot more limited and narrow but they're a lot easier to get through and especially with things like lures where if there's not a lot of functionality to them and it's just sort of you know like the surface contours that are new and different from other things a design pattern is going to be more relative going to be more relevant to something like that whereas if there's more functionality if it has unique designs more complex the utility pattern may be the way to go with those things but that's something you want to talk to your patent attorney about is you know sometimes we actually file both we'll do a design patent and utility patent on the same thing and protecting sort of the ornamental design of some pieces but then some functionality of other stuff as well yeah so we can pull up one of those uh patents right now this is a um utility patent yes and um you know can you like all these patents i look at have these crazy drawings well they're not even crazy drawings it looks like somebody drove it by hand and then all these numbers and um and so these numbers i think relate to points down here usually is that correct yeah so usually so there's really three parts of a of a patent application and an issue pattern there's going to be the the description and that's called some typical specification um and then there's going to be the drawings which you kind of point out and then there's going to be the claims which that's the section you have up right now and especially it's the claims that actually define the meats and bounds of what is owned and not owned in the pack so think of it like a legal description on your house so in if you're gonna be selling your house you're gonna be putting out pictures of of stuff on on the website or whatever but what really determines what you own in terms of the house and the land it's that legal description right it's not pictures of the you know pictures of stuff um it's only that legal description that really says hey this is the land that i own versus what i don't and the claims are just like that the claims to find the meats and bounds of what's protecting what's not and a good example of that is so for instance a lot of times the claims are just a subset of what is in the description and the drawings and people usually look at the drawings and descriptions say well all of this is protected you know by the patent that's completely untrue a lot of times it's just a small subset of that or something that's really narrow and specific um so you kind of have to look at that claim section to really determine what's protected and what's not and that's a big mistake that a lot of folks make when looking at patents so the question i would have is so these are all numbered obviously here and is it kind of is this like all-inclusive um or is there like ores between these things or there's ands you know so if if i had let's just take this random lure for example if i had like the same thing but without this top part number 18 right is that now not infringing or is that kind of a case-by-case basis yeah so essentially look at the claims it's perfect then the way you do a an infringement analysis you have to infringe at least one claim of an issued and enforceable patent that's another thing to keep in mind is that like a lot of times you'll be looking at patent publications these things are publications of pending applications or applications that went abandoned and people will freak out oh my gosh like you know these planes are so broad and they they told me it's like well this application never issued it's 10 years old it went abandoned it didn't go through it's not an active uh issued patent so that's something you should keep in mind this one is an issue patent so for instance here like let's look at claim one so to infringe claim one you have to have all the elements in each of those lines and here there's no oars it's going to be an and thing right so you know let's start with the first one so a fishing lure comprising okay right so you're probably gonna have a fishing lure comprised and then the next thing would be the next line is a first connecting rod having opposed first and second ends the first and first end of the first connecting rod being secured to the fishing line so you would look at your product say does it have that or does it not and then you go through each of those elements and if your product has all of those things you would be infringing that claim one and therefore would be infringing the path that that makes sense yeah you know the thing i love about trying to read patents is they're
Thanks for your comment Dong Lightner, have a nice day.
- Altha Cesare, Staff Member
the invention is provided with various spinners located on either side of the fishing lure in an outrigger configuration this location provides for reflected light in a 360 degree pattern thus providing the appearance of multiple fish swimming together the moving nature of the spinners provides vibrations and sounds in the water attracting additional fish the invention is provided with a movable eye mechanism for enhanced realistic appearance when compared to conventional fixed eye configurations the invention is approximately four inches long and one inch wide
Thanks Keesha your participation is very much appreciated
- Altha Cesare
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I've studied evolution at Montreat College in Montreat and I am an expert in poetics. I usually feel angry. My previous job was surgeon I held this position for 11 years, I love talking about astronomy and jaw harp. Huge fan of Rajiv Surendra I practice american football and collect books.
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